Former Clemson University president Jim Barker joined longtime Tigerillustrated.com writer Larry Williams on this edition of The Clemson Dubcast to share what he's been up to since leaving the high-pressure world of running a university.

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Barker had a fascinating window into Dabo Swinney long before many other people thought the coach had what it took to run a successful football program, let alone a perennially dominant one.

Barker still teaches a course at Clemson called "The Architecture of Leadership," and Swinney's name comes up often in the class' conversations about great leaders.

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